Should Pa Game Land Gates Be Left Open For Predator Hunters

[uncle buck]

Do you think that the PGC should allow the gates to be open for predator hunters and trappers beyond the Jan Flintlock season...There is so much good predator calling,  rabbit hunting,  and trapping deep with the confines of the PGL in the winter months. How nice it would be if you could drive back on some of the PGL and hunt the ridges for coyotes or set traps for bobcat etc etc etc...

I have posted a survey on Hunting Pa if you would like to vote one way or the other. 



http://www.huntingpa.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1132013#Post1132013

[scott]

why are the game lands closed in the first place,  imo they should be open year round.   

[swarter2]

why are the game lands closed in the first place,  imo they should be open year round.   

Good Question.

I was driving around Nockamixon State Park and the surrounding PGL's.  Majority of the gates that are usually open were closed.  So, I drove to the local donut shop and found some Park Rangers and a WCO.  I asked them what was up with gates being closed.  They told me it was because they have found a number of the food plots torn up by people off roading after the late season closes.  They said they should be opening up agian within the week for Turkey season.

[uncle buck]

Notice on the survey that a few post's want the gates closed to keep off the dirt bike riders..Do you think that keeps the dirt bike riders off?  I have been hunting on PGL 210 in June and July...Back and forth and back and forth at high speeds are numerous dirt bike riders... Also horse back riders too.. Don't know if this is legal now?  to be able to ride horses on the PGL?  Notice on that particular PGL that they drive their horse trailers up and park them in the parking lot.  Now if the law says it legal then thats is fine by me...

Also the PGC is trying to accomadate all kinds of hunters.  Price of the general license and the furtakers are the same price. I buy both and all the little tags that go with them.   They need to open the gates since furtakers pay the same price as the genreal hunters do.  Also they need to throw the book real hard at all the violators who do drive on PGL.   Maybe the game law should say only automible are allowed.... Shame .....since disabled hunters could use ATV to get deep into the PGL..   Slobs are going to violate the game laws anyway...Whether the gates are closed or open...

[swarter2]

I took a long walk back into SGL 157 today.  Which is in Bucks Co. and known as Haycock Mtn.  The gate to this SGL has been closed 5-6yrs due to the range being closed.  However, I was saddened to see the PGC has deforested the woods.  I say deforested because a large tract has been timbered.  They take the good, profitable wood, then leave the tops and limbs.  They are supposed to be improving the habitat.  To me they are making it worse. 

Several years ago the PGC had done some clearing at the top of the Mtn.  The guy that did the work did it free of charge as long as he got the profit from the sale of the lumber.  Now it has been a couple of yrs since I've hiked to the top of the Mtn.  SO I did it today.  A lot of what was penetrable is now impenetrable.  What I mean by that, is that there is no way to enter the woods from the path because  the undergrowth is thick.

Are any of you guys seeing this on other SGL?

[Critterslayer51]

swarter2,

I've seen this at almost every PA Game land and even the state forests as well, actually especially the state forests. I've hunted the state forest out in western Perry Co for years, and also hunted the largest state forest in the state quite a bit, being Tioga State Forest. I seen what you're dealing with, leaving the tree tops and undesirable wood, which clutters up the ground and its hard to get through. The PGC will tell you this is not a bad thing for PA's critters, but often more of a good thing. I totally see you're point and won't argue that, because i've been in some situations in which that big buck slipped away into such "brush." On the same tokken, I can see the PGC's side of the story. Our enviroments are in constant ecological change, from grasslands all the way up to dense mature hardwoods, and from the hardwoods back to grasslands. With humans in the mix, we see the hardwoods to grasslands as tragic ( ie. forest fires), but its really only natures way of adding more life to the area. When the PGC cuts down timber, yes they make a buck or two off the wood, but lets put that aside for now. They're making open area's where the sun can now hit the floor of the forest in its entirely. When the trees were up, the sun would pop through here and there, leaving little patches of undergrowth. Now, with no trees you have natural undergrowth poping up everywhere (reason why you can't walk through that stuff at the top of the mountain), due to winds bringing in seeds from elsewhere and those seeds germenating quickly due to the increase of sunlight. Now all of the forests critters have NEW plants to eat, NEW places to hide, and NEW places to bare young. I know it sucks to hunt in, but on the PGC's side, I think thats what they're trying to get at, a gretter health for the forestry. This is also a reason for those 10ft high fences you see from time to time in a SGL or SF, those are in place to keep deer out until that section of forest is where the biologist want the growth to be at, so it can sustain deer populations.  Sorry if that all sounds like I got technical on you, but after reading your post, it was the first thing that popped into my mind, so please don't take it the wrong way.

[yotehunter74]

        Well jmo,  but a few points are valid..... YES i feel the gates should be open longer to allow full use of the SGL to predator hunter/trappers. I know that no gate is going to keep out the dirt bikes and ATVs .... in the same respect I also see no need and do not want to see all the game lands open all year long. In the summer months I personally have no problem with letting the critters have a little privacy. Also in the summer months the gate may not help against dirt bikes but the do offer some protection again the teens who borrowed dads car and want to go party.

        The gates get closed in most areas from the end of muzzleloader season until just before spring gobbler, why cant we try to reach an agreement and get the PGC to keep the gates open straight through until the end of spring gobbler then lock it up. It may not be perfect to everyone but it would allow us more time afield, and also not require the fight for keeping the gates open all year. I would support something like this, but not being open all yr.  As i said above  jmo

     Steve

[jaspr1]

UB,I think you are right on with this one. There is absolutely no reason to shut these Game Land roads especially the ones that have parking areas. Those of us who are putting on a few years don't need the extra distance anymore,bad knees, etc. So we either hunt the fringe or we think about quitting. A good example and I know you know this place is, Millers Gap on SGL270 if you park at the Appalachian Trail area you have a 1/2 mile walk just to get to PGC parking area. As a Deputy back in the 80's I used to patrol these spots and the argument to close them was to cut down on beer parties,off roaders, parkers and drug dealers. Note none of these are hunters using the game lands legitimately. PGC didn't want to police them and either did the Local Twp. police. One of the problems that occurs when you don't pay attention to access areas is what happened at Rattlin Rock Road also on 270. In the 60's this place was marked by a State sign for access, when I was a deputy the WCO would have me put access signs at the end of this road which was a Cul De Sac, there was a single lane rut going off of it with private land on either side. TWP. abandoned this road and landowner seeing an oppurtunity built a house there and a lawn now covers this road...this spot is gone forever...

[Hern]

Use a bicycle. Many do.
I like the idea of the gates closed.
PGC WCO Oficers have too many roads to cover as is.
You would get kids holding partys for the weekend and riff-raff tear'n up things on themthere back roads, outdatheway places.
As my knees are going bad, gaining weight and aging, I still like the idea of gated roads on State land.
Those roads can be an advantage to ole farts, I shot 3 deer by still hunting them roads, stop for and hour or two or three then move to another spot. Easy walking and yes game cross themthere roads.

[longhair]

Use a bicycle.

Hmmmmmmm...let us picture this. Hern on a bicycle, carring all his backpacks full of stuff. Rifle slung over his shoulder. Lunch in his basket mounted over the front wheel. And he hits a rut full of water. Then, after getting all straightened out, he shoots a deer.

Know'n Hern, he'd shoot the bike and ride the deer out to the truck. 

[bigben]

  I have started to get out and do more walking and know the advantages of areas that are in further then the normal hunters walking distance.  I was thinking about using a bycycle but in many instances I can get into a spot walking a road using my own two feet rather then a bike.  might not be the quickest way but I see alot more while walking.  when bikeing you need to be looking down the road in front of ya for obstacles and such.  alot depends on the individual though.  I know that in the tuscarora state forest they close many of the roads down that go up into the mountian for fear of people with ill equipped vehicles sliding off the side of the mountian.  maybe they should make it mandatory to have tire chains on in adverse weather conditions and enforce the rules?  I know that the state forest roads around here get a work out on the weekends mainly starting after labor day with just general people that want to get out in the outdoors.  they normally hop in the car for a sunday drive lookin for critters and that is it.  as far as sgl's though.  all the ones around home here you can walk the distances fairly easy and I have not seen many of the roads open for vehicular usage unless your a farmer.  I know after the firearms season that is it.  sometimes it is muzzleloader season.  I know at herder springs we allmost got locked in that one year the wco's and forest rangers were locking all the gates up the day after muzzleloader was out.  

[payotechaser]

Keep them open til end of hunting and trapping season.maybee end of february. Mink ,muskrat,beaver season is still in.Some winters are milder than others ,roads may be usable.Lock gates for summer so less vandalism occurs.Lopez to nordmount is 6 to 10 miles?Thats alot of state land you wont be able to use when gates are locked.

[jaspr1]

Going back to UB's original post. If you are out to coyote or fox hunt having these roads closed is a big disadvantage when the hunting is away from the macadam. I don't want to stop at 2am get my bike and ride back anywhere, especially when it was sportsmens dollars which purchased this property to begin with. If they wish to lock out roads beyond the parking lots so be it but in many instances you are being locked out of the parking areas and you have no access. Block a gate once and see how quick someone manages to patrol down the road and cites you.

[uncle buck]

Normally when you walk in the hunt is over for coyotes... Now if you drive in and get up on them ridges and call down your going to get yourself some coyotes thats for sure...See your actually walking down into the lowlands and want to get up high...The coyotes are in the swamps. They hear you walking in and it's over.  Now I can't see into a coyote head but I am sure if a car came by they would get alarmed but lets say 5 to 10 minutes later they would be use to it. Especially if the gate was open for hunters to drive back until after flintlock season.  However hunting high and shooting down into the low lands is a good strategy....However if you going through the lowlands and climbing the mountain to call it's all over... Even if you call down the other side of the ridge after you walk in it's all over then too....

I like to hunt Northeastern Pa public lands and the roads are open there until after muzzeloader season...I have called from the high points to the lowlandsan have had coyotes come to the call. However once the gate closes the season are over in that neck of the woods.

[bigben]

interesting ub.