Like I said before... When using the 24V 223/12 I have killed one gray fox and one coyote and both were shotgunned. the gray with high Brass # 4's and the coyote with Deadcoyote T. Not that the 223 won't hit... Just what developed when we were calling..I have a Weaver 4 X 12 on my 223/12 Savage 24V.