PPHA Forums
Predator Hunting => Predator Hunting => Topic started by: QUATTRO on March 18, 2015, 03:35:12 PM
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How many of you guys on here locate for coyotes? What is your preferred method? I will say for myself, I rarely ever do it. Have considered buying a hand crank siren in the past and already have sirens downloaded on my Shockwave, but I never made it a practice ...the more I think about it, the silly'r it seems NOT to do it. Especially on large properties and as part of the scouting regiment on new properties. I suppose on some spots it isn't a necessity but seems like a "no lose" tactic in some scenarios.
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I've heard of guys using locator howels. I would think that could cause them to come in before I'm set and ready. I don't use locater calls or sirens.
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The use of a siren in place of an actual vocal is to illicit an instictive response and not an actual appearance...I know that is the train of thought behind it...but if guys are running around blaring sirens I suppose it's just a matter of time til they are educated to that sound as well.
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I guess I should have worded my question differently now that I read it..meant to ask if anyone on here used sirens as locators and what were the results/methods..I have used vocals as strictly locators but only a very limited amount of times in the past..with mixed results in terms of responses...more interested in the use of siren type locators based on the theory that it will get you just a response and not have them show up necessarily..sorry
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If I a strictly hunting yotes I locate using a siren or howling or sometimes both before I make a stand. I prefer using a siren. Using a "locater howl or howls" could result in them coming in and there u are with your pants down. My method is locate them then setup on them. Just cause u don't locate them don't mean there not there. I have went many hours during the night did not get a response then come back through a few hours later and they responded. I don't know what it is but it is like a switch turned on. This has happend to me many of nights locating. U will be surprised where one night u will hear them and the next night where there will be. Then u have coyotes that r in roughly the same area. But yes I use a siren
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Brushwolf
When you hear coyotes at a different area from your listening point how do you know they are the same coyotes you think they are?
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Ya can you tell if the coyotes are Lancaster SEPA Coyotes or Luzerne county NEPA coyotes by their ethnic twang of their howls! You got your Amish Coyotes and you got your Polish Coyotes! :)
On two occasions one being on a hunt with Scott police sirens in the night caused coyotes to howl. The one time here in Cumberland county the police siren on a major highway near by caused a coyote to open up. I quickly went from my fox hunting sounds to my coyote scenario and called in the biggest coyote ever!
Train whistles, horns and bells ! Wow now do they get the coyotes howling!
You could tell after awhile if a coyote is a female or male by the pitch of the vocals! Low a older male and high a female! Yes use sirens to locate them big time!
In defense of if you can tell if it's the same coyote above.. If the food source is good the coyotes will hang around for quite a long time.. So you could actually get to hear them howl often..
By all means use sirens to locate them...Actually any loud noise will get them howling but I just can't see us predator hunter breaking the night silence with the air horns we use on our boats for safety.. the farmers household would get sick of hearing that constantly.
So many things we do post on here we need to ask ourselves is this theory or is it fact.. The siren thing IMO is fact. Read an article once that you should locate them in the morning hours with sirens and then sneak back in the sun up time frame and call them in with a rabbit distress.. There have been times when calling that two howls right at the beginning of the calling scenario called in two coyotes within 20 seconds of doing the howls.. This has happened for me twice now.. so nope don't ever use howling to try to locate coyotes..
Something too that coyotes will sometimes come in for food distress sounds when calling fox and other times will not even be bothered when your calling fox but they are there...The coyote is such a unpredictable critter that's for sure..
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Ya can you tell if the coyotes are Lancaster SEPA Coyotes or Luzerne county NEPA coyotes by their ethnic twang of their howls! You got your Amish Coyotes and you got your Polish Coyotes! :)
Great feedback ..I think the siren locating will be something I use more often..And as for Polish twangs, I am married to a bona fide Polish woman so I am quite familiar with being barked at in that twang! I hear it daily brother!
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Quattro I can say the Polish thing because I'm Slovak .. So we are are just over the border to each other in Europe.. LOL wow those Polish women can sure cook!!!!!
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Quattro I can say the Polish thing because I'm Slovak .. So we are are just over the border to each other in Europe.. LOL wow those Polish women can sure cook!!!!!
HAHA! Yes they can! And I'm Italian so its a double whammy when it comes to food! It's even better when you can eat over there...and the vodka is mandatory at every meal! Actually, going back there in May for a wedding... Been a goal of mine to set up a fox hunting trip one of these times we go over in the winter...although they currently live in the city, her family still owns the farm that her father grew up in..absolutely beautiful from a fox hunting guys perspective...and believe me, last winter we went there and visited the farm I was looking for fox the whole time..last trip out, on the way back, I finally saw a big ol red mousing in the snow..it was cool.
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Brushwolf
When you hear coyotes at a different area from your listening point how do you know they are the same coyotes you think they are?
Well this is from locating farmland one night and hearing say a pair and come back and locate at the same place and hear a pair from the next farm over or like a 1/2 mile from where you heard them the night before. That's why I think they are the same yotes.
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Brushwolf
Thanks for the answer. I would also think they are the same ones since no others howled some were else at the same time. But i am never sure. The only time I feel sure is if they howl at the same place. I wish we had more reasurch information on pa coyotes
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You are so right Ernie. There's definitely not much to be found on our dogs. The most information I have gotten was from listening and talking to you! and I dont want to leave out Hern as he has some great information also!
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I may have posted this a few years back, not sure. Really no need to locate out here in the desert, find a good location and start calling. However I was reading about how guys will play a siren to locate coyotes and we all know that dogs will howl at firetrucks or a police siren so it must work. I decided to give it a try. Went to a rather wide but shallow sendero where I have called coyotes in before. Sat down and turned on the siren, had illegals jumping out all over the place, they must of thought the border patrol was closing in on them.
On another point not related to calling: UB said "I can say the Polish thing because I'm Slovak" and then Quattro said " I'm Italian ". Are you guys here on a green card or are you illegals. Why do people say they are whatever, when I'm asked my nationality I say I'm American and proud of it.
Just one of my pet peeves, if I made you think about it -- good.
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;D ;D ;D ;D CJ I remember hearing the siren and illegals jumping before and still laugh at it....as far as what I am ??? ??? ??? ??? Just a silly Goose.... ;) ;) ;) ;)
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On another point not related to calling: UB said "I can say the Polish thing because I'm Slovak" and then Quattro said " I'm Italian ". Are you guys here on a green card or are you illegals. Why do people say they are whatever, when I'm asked my nationality I say I'm American and proud of it.
Just one of my pet peeves, if I made you think about it -- good.
This is almost so trivial its not worth the reply. I'll just say don't over think this guys pride of country...this country. I'll leave it at that. I appreciate the concern though..I think you just needed to look a little closer at the actual context of the conversation..and there is also nothing wrong with recognizing where you're heritage is from..that has nothing to do with ones pride of being American..in fact, in some cases it makes you more proud...If I made you think about it --good.
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AMEN Quattro!
We are predator hunters thats what we are!
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I was hunting with my brother and nephew this morning. As soon as the Alpha Dogg Coyote with Rabbit expert hunt broke the silence the lowest possible howl I ever heard in my life broke the silence 150 yards on a ridge. I could tell it was a old male dog! 2 min into the sequence he came down off that ridge and I could see his eyes at the 90 yard mark. It was i that busted us. He got right in line with the sound and my scent cone and he disappeared just like that. I could tell it was a male and I could tell it was a old dog!
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CJ PetPeeves? I remember a another one of your is when a hunter refers to a coyote as a YOTE or YOTES!
Pennsylvania is a great melting pot of immagrants. They came here to work in the hard coal ans soft coal jobs. All the ethnic groups just lived in same towns. They did that for strength. Areas of the state are known for the particular ethnic groups! NEPA has many Slovak and Polish, Italians, Irish, Welsh, Hungarian, etc. The city of Pittsburgh is the same way while towns like Philadelphia are not. Many of us still follow all the traditions of our ethnic groups during all the holidays. That's were our pride comes in. We actually are Americans first. I wouldn't vote for a president just because he was a Slovak. Now look at the other ethnic races in America. Furgeson, Mo some of those people put their ethnics first before the American way. This is sickening!!!put their ethnic background before a police officer who offers somewhat protection. There are parts of Pa that there is no ethnic pride. People don't even know Where they came from. CJ i think your of Italian decent. Surely your mom and dad had special foods and traditions when you lived in Pa? I tell you one thing I'm not going to rally for a Slovak month and get pissed off if doesn't happen. If I felt that way I best get on a plane and go back to Slovakia. People don't like America and put their ethnic first need to take all that immagration Federal money and give them plane and bus tickets to their old country locations.
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To call a coyote they have to be there. Pa calling blindly into the night makes people think they are failures at calling. However if a coyote was there with proper triggers to that coyotes brain it will come in.
Sirens do give you a tool to use to see if coyotes are in a area. However your best way to know if they are there is word of mouth.
That coyote I called in this morning. The caretaker of that land saw it yesterday morning on that farm. I knew it was there and I used the right sound on the Alpha Dogg to get a response.
I should of placed my scent cone on line with the abandoned farm house and that would have blocked my scent cone. My nephew would have had a shot. Goes to show you in populated Pa? 20 yards to the right would have given my shooter a shot.
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This topic is too important to discuss my pet peeves so I moved my reply to you and QUATTRO to Off Topic.
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>:( >:( >:( >:( Hmmmmm I see it was deleted....I wonder why the truth can not be told?? :-X :-X :-X :-X
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I deleted it, due to its content!
I don't believe this is the platform to discuss why one is against another's ethnic background and why they feel others should not feel the way they do about said background ie family history, or where their ancestors came from.
I found it to be in bad taste.
If anyone would like to discuss this further, I'm easy to get a hold of.
Cell 717-916-8132
Email spart66@yahoo.com
Or on here.
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Darin – “I found it to be in bad taste.” You have bad taste buds. You said and I quote: “ why one is against another's ethnic background and why they feel others should not feel the way they do about said background ie family history, or where their ancestors came from.”
No place, absolutely no place in my reply did I even hint that I was AGAINST anyone’s ethnic background, family history or AGAINST where their ancestors came from. You have poor comprehension skills of the American language.
I have made many friends on this site and have not only invited them out here but have had them stay in our home while they are here. They are of all ethnic backgrounds, to insinuate that I am some sort of biased/racist person is totally unfounded and again no place did I indicate such in my reply.
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I was posting land today for a property owner. Location? Wow snow never lies! Saw all kinds if tracks in the snow even about a 32 pound coyote track! Coon, deer, red fox and turkey were present! If your in the Pa snow area today just take a walk on one of your properties!
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I must be dumb then, thank you for pointing it out CJ!
I will delete it again and again if need be. I already said this is not the platform for what was in your post and that's how it is.
Feel free to contact UB and Quattro via PM if you would like them to know what your original post stated.
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I must be dumb then, thank you for pointing it out CJ!
At least we agree on something.
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CoyoteJohn said: "I have made many friends on this site and have not only invited them out here but have had them stay in our home while they are here. They are of all ethnic backgrounds, to insinuate that I am some sort of biased/racist person is totally unfounded and again no place did I indicate such in my reply."
CoyoteJohn ,I hope you saw the personal message I left you. Furthermore, it is funny how you use the word insinuate here when you called into question my patriotism and insinuated that I perhaps wanted to lay claim to some other country as my homeland..and please do not say you were merely proclaiming a pet peeve of yours. You took something totally out of context and spun it into something so far from what was being said it was pathetic. I am all in favor of having your post, that you left under the "off topic" section, re-posted so more can see how far out in left field you really were on this. You asked questions such as "if Slovakia or Italy declared war, would you fight for the USA?" ...seriously??.. you asked that to someone who is a veteran! Seems as though you like to stir the pot and sit behind a computer and watch what comes of it. Like I said in my PM to you, you have nothing to worry about as far as my love of country and do not know me well enough to be in position to draw any conclusions about it. Lastly, I appreciate your passion.. especially when we do have people in this very country that have questionable loyalty to this great land..not to mention certain groups globally that wish to undermine our ways. However, I suggest you spend your energy on those people and not on people like myself and others who you attacked based on something that you obviously took out of context....
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I'm gonna jump in here and point out that you are an "American" you were born and raised here period!!!!!! an adjective added is just your claim to some sort of heritage....but the bottom line is "American" and rest assured there are a lot of Vets on this site. We are all attached to some historical heritage, but not all believe it needs to be flaunted as we all are Heinz 57 variety...
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I'm gonna jump in here and point out that you are an "American" you were born and raised here period!!!!!! an adjective added is just your claim to some sort of heritage....but the bottom line is "American" and rest assured there are a lot of Vets on this site. We are all attached to some historical heritage, but not all believe it needs to be flaunted as we all are Heinz 57 variety...
Ok, I'll jump back in here too... are you going to sit here and "point out" to me that I'm American?? This is laughable.. Again, its not needed, but thank you..I have made it crystal clear where I stand on that and yet some are still trying to drive home some outlandish idea it is otherwise based on absolutely nothing. It's beyond ridiculous. And "flaunted"...?? Who was flaunting anything?? Please clarify where..Seems some of you got awfully bent out of shape over it.. you must have the same insecurities, I mean "pet peeve" as CoyoteJohn...and although this was on an open forum, my remark about "being Italian" was directed solely to someone else and not you and only made in keeping with the context of the conversation him and I were having..but it seems this context thing is a concept a chosen few on here seem unable to grasp or simply want to overlook...perhaps because their initial gripe holds no water...hard to say which. So let me ask you goose, did you read CoyoteJohns post in the off topic section before it was deleted?? I can tell you, since you mentioned vets, I found it utterly inflammatory and rude to question a veterans loyalty to this country as he did in that post..do you feel that was justified based on something as simple as mentioning ones heritage? Apparently so, since you felt the need to inject yourself into it. If your true goal is to show you patriotism and stand up for America, I'm all for it and I stand with you, as a proud American, but if your goal is to attack others you don't know anything about, based on something that is clearly not an issue at this point, than God Bless you and have fun taking that walk with CoyoteJohn and whoever else wants to join you..I'll choose to go a different route.
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QUATTRO, let me give you a little insight into my background, twenty-two years military service, most of that time in the SF community, the last portion of my career were spent in three top-tier Spec Ops units, one Silver Star, two Bronze Stars, two Purple Hearts plus many other "minor" awards, citation and medals. Went from Pvt E-1 to Chief Warrant Officer 4, the highest rank a Warrant could obtain at that time. Battlefield appointment from Sergeant First Class to Warrant Officer-1 during the Vietnam conflict. Right now I'm fighting the results of Agent Orange and shrapnel resting against my spine which severely limits my mobility without crutches, cane, walker or wheelchair. After you digest that tell me that you think I would disrespect a veteran. You said you are Italian, UB said he is Slovak, I questioned the validity of that and asked a few questions of both, one was if we went to war with either of these countries who would you side with. A very valid question if in fact you are who you said you are, if you think that was disrespectful to UB then he needs to step up to the plate and address it.
One thing I learned while serving in the SF: We mean what we say and we say what we mean. Do you also live by that code?
Goose I'll lift a Makers Mark to ya tonight and I haven't had one in many years - Doctors orders, but I'm looking for a new doc. However now approaching seventy-five I can bend the rules a little.
UB, I still see red when I hear the words Yote or Yotes. But now I just shrug it off as being to lazy to spell the entire word, or a lack of spelling skills.
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;) ;) Granddad back at you CJ
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I really think this disagreement has nothing to do with ethnic talk. I do still think that there is still a bitter taste in people mouths because of what transpired when I had the web site...I took that web site down because I was asked to choose between one clique vs another clique that developed on the site... So much so that I was told that if I didn't allow someone to have their say people were going to stop posting... So I chose not to side with either clique and shut the site down.. Actually people who really have met me have to say that I'm a real easy going person and they know I wouldn't stab them in the back..So where you strong with things you learned from SF I learned from my father. He always told me not to be like other people...
As far as vets...I do respect all of what you have given for your country John...As many know I am actually a veteran of the U. S. Coast Guard...Now your making me say things that I shouldn't say John... Not everyone can be a Coast Guardsman... I actually volunteered to go to Vietnam in 1971 on the U. S. Coast guard Cutter Mellon.. Some other Coast Guardsman from district office got to go that had my same rate and rank... I was a 2nd class Petty Officer.. E5. I have no guilt about being in the CG because of this.. I did want to go but they the CG wanted someone else to go. I served on a Coast Guard Air Station at Barbers Point Hawaii for 2 years and then I was on a Coast Guard Cutter in the Gulf of Mexico.. I met my wife there.. She is Irish Native American but she is also a a veteran of the U. S. Navy.. So there you have it both of us are Vets!!!!
Would I invade my home country.. Now remember this both all my grandparents.. my mom and dad are of Slovak ethnic background.. You bet I would invade if I had too..My parents were first generation Americans and I am 2nd generation American..My uncles and cousin of Slovak Ethnic background fought in World war 2. However I am Slovak but could care less about some politican that was Slovak that was running for office.. Actually I would like to see Dr Ben Carson as President before any of the other Republicans...
The only medals that I received was the National Defense Medal but so did my wife.. that's the only one she received too. As we all know all vets that were in the military during Vietnam received that metal.. I did lose the tip of my finger while out in the Gulf of Mexico..However it did not qualify for even 10 % disability.. However I did get the satisfaction of being one of the few Coast Guardsman that gave the Coast Guard my finger and got away with it...
Summary..IMO... This had nothing to do with ethnic and being an American first... There is just some sour grapes from things that have gone by... That was the best thing that ever happened to me shutting that web site down... I get to hunt more now!!!!
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Where to begin. First off, thanks to both UB and CJ for your service ..in whatever capacity it was. It is appreciated. Now, moving on to what you have said CoyoteJohn. Having fully digested what you put out there I stick to my guns when I said I felt you slighted a fellow vet. Whether you served as well or not you still asked the questions you did and in my mind that was uncalled for and disrespectful..if you think I'm going to waiver on my words, I will not. You do not need to be in the Special Forces to say what you mean and mean what you say either. And I mean that... If you feel you do, you are not only mistaken but delusional. I am not going to beat a dead horse. You felt the need for whatever reason to make an issue out of something that was a non issue and spin it with a bunch of rhetoric to sound as if was a noble cause. It was a valiant effort but you failed. If anything, it was counter productive. It was an assumption, and a correct one at that, on both my part and Uncle Bucks, that when we were mentioning "being" Italian or Slovak it was in the context of heritage not where we wanted to "claim", as you so put it, as the country we declare ourselves from. You chose to make it something it was not. And for someone who wants to call into question everybody else's motives and core values it is easy to question yours as well...In your deleted post you said you felt that both UB and I were proud Americans..if that was the case the whole time then why even bother bringing all this into question? And just a side note..I say yote and yotee, how ironic, another pet peeve of yours..well, if you say what you mean and mean what you say ... I must be lazy or unable to spell..when you find proof of either let me know...and just to point out, in your above post when you said "to lazy to spell the entire word" ...it should be "too"...just saying.
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I'm not sure I've ever seen a post go so far off topic. It started out with a lot of good info.
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Yes. Way off track. Time to move on with the BS and get it back on track. Thanks Uncle Buck for attempting to do so. On that note:
I went out Thursday to a nice large property I have. I decided to head up a little early and do some siren locating. I went to a few separate locations just as 5-6 pm rolled around and played Cals Federal Siren out of my Shockwave and waited for a response... nothing...this spot has coyotes too.. that is a term that is sometimes used loosely but for this property it is true..there are dogs here...we took a nice male out of here just a few weeks ago and have had many encounters of various forms in the past. But this property is also pretty large. Its basically 3 parcels of land that total well over 1000 acres. Not to mention it is surrounded by other large parcels. After locating I circled back and made two 45-50 minute stands before the night got cut short due to a minor emergency back home. Although there was no responses to my sirens, I am going to continue to do it...I will next try to locate in the early morning and set up later on in the afternoon.. here is a picture of just one of the our stand locations...I missed a coyote here last winter off to the left of the frame...it was hugging the woodline and moving at a nice clip. In hindsight it was a farther shot than I should have taken but we were not calling at the time but checking a deer carcass that the owner had told us was a coyote kill.
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Every farmers and nursery that allows you to hunt on.. Make sure you tell them to give you a call if they hear coyotes howling or if they see one... It's up to you then if you want to get out there that next night and try to call them in.. I have had farmers tell me when they see the coyotes feeding on the garbage piles and have gone back.. they would tell me what time they saw them etc.. In the one case it was at 6;00 PM. So I returned the next day at 6:00 PM and I did call in that coyote... Set up a communication link between the farmer and you..Thats just what happened the other day.. .I said it on another post... The care taker saw the coyote in the morning.. That evening after dark my brother and I returned and I did call in that coyote...
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yup, intel from the property owners is a big help..I get that on a fair amount of the properties I have..and I always ask when I get a chance. Last winter, on a visit up to call, the owner told us that there were two deer killed by coyotes in the same field that's in the picture above. He had told us the coyotes were able to chase the deer over the thin layer of snow on top where as the deer couldn't get proper traction due to a layer of ice underneath and would eventually fall and that is when the coyotes would overtake them. He told us when they went to plow the access road the coyotes were returning to pick at the carcasses. So me and my partner snuck in as best we could to spy the carcasses and see if we couldn't catch one picking at the scraps or en route to them. Well, turns out, we pretty much caught one running the far treeline probably 350+ yds. out ..but he must have been on to us and wasn't stopping..I had brought my 22-250 along for the walk but had left the tri pod shooting sticks in my truck..I was left trying to free hand a shot..didn't happen. Needless to say, we walked out to check the carcass anyhow and we were actually able to re-trace the entire events in the snow..two coyotes came out of the wooded ridge on the left of the picture and ran the deer that was in the field..you could see several instances where the the deer had fallen and crashed through the snow and ice and got up again..if I recall, it had fallen three or four times before the coyotes were finally able to overtake it..the tracks and crushed snow painted a perfect picture of what happened..it was pretty easy to see exactly how the events unfolded..this was the first time I saw for myself a deer that was actually taken by coyotes..I have found deer carcasses before which coyotes had partially or almost completely eaten but could not conclude if they actually took the deer down or merely picked at the remains of a deer that met its death from another cause. Point is, like you said UB..the owners can provide critical information you can use as a tool. The info we got was spot on. Unfortunately, as usually is the case, ole wily gave us the slip.