PPHA Forums
Predator Hunting => Predator Hunting => Topic started by: Buckwheat on September 13, 2014, 10:06:47 PM
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Ok, what do you guys think is the best county in pa for coyotes. I am looking to try different county's for coyotes. I have hunted almost all the county's. The south central is the only spot I have not hunted much.
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Ernie, I think that would depend on if you are asking what county has the most coyotes or the county that has the most success in calling. Many counties with the most coyotes also have the highest calling pressure. Counties like York may have few coyotes, but a lot of people don't realize that there are coyotes in York County, therefore the hunting pressure is less.....
For Example: I have a camp in Clinton County. I am always hearing Coyotes going off. However, my calling success is very limited. I think thats mostly due to the amount of hunting and calling pressure up there.
I call mostly in York County. I have actually called in more Coyotes in York County than Clinton County, even though I think there are fewer Yotes in York County. Soooo.....Compareing Clinton County with York County, I would pick York. The most populated area's with the most limited amount of hunting pressure.....Like the outskirts of Pittsburgh and Philly!!
Not sure if this helps, but it might spark come further comments....
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Jack
Thanks for your repky. I know here are coyotes in all the county's. I am asking what one has the most. The are many reasons why you have less luck seeing coyotes in Clinton county. I have hunted the northern countries and kill a few. I think the main reason it is harder up north is just because it is bigger areas to hunt and hard to control your sent in the woods.
In broken farm land it has always been easier to call coyotes and they have alot more contact with humans and there sent. I could go on more but I for now i am just interested in what county's have the most coyotes.
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Everything that I have read on line indicates that North East parts of PA have the highest populations. Define North East....??? I couldn't fine anything that give statistics on kills or numbers trapped.
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I'm on overload here in southern Beaver co. I'm retired and still don't have enough time in the week to hunt all the places landowners have invited me to get rid of them. Seen more coyote than deer tracks in the snow last winter.
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I agree,
beaver Lawrence and mercer counties have a lot of coyotes.
I sat by a fire last night and heard a lone howl a few hundred yards away then an answer to that by a single a few hundred yards in the other direction. Then I could hear a pack sound off way off in the distance.
Yep Ernie, we got a coyote behind every tree out here in the west
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Hmmmm ??? ??? ???, maybe just maybe :-\ :-\ :-\, we should do a Northwest hunt instead of a North Central hunt :o :o :o
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Goose
Those 3 county's are east pa. The reason they had the north central hunt was because of all the state forrest land. You can hunt for a week and not ask permission. But it would be good to hunt an area that had a lot more coyotes.
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The last two years we've done the March Madness hunt, which was a statewide hunt....Not a single coyote was entered last year - No winner.
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Misterjake
Interesting information about the state wide hunt.
Has anybody hunted the south central for coyotes.
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Buckwheat,
We have numerous members from that region, but for some reason, (Lack of time etc) there were no entries. I would have to check the older posts to see who won the march Madness hunt 2 years ago....
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I've hunted coyotes in 2 places in my life...........so my "areas" have not been vast.......... Clinton County and Missouri (Henry County to be exact) 100 stands per coyote in Clinton county and in Missouri we were bringing in or getting responses on just about every stand.......... Clinton County is tricky very few private areas to gain access too, plus it is hit hard with other hunting seasons and not to mention the mosquito creek hunt.......... Coyotes here come in during the early season very well after deer and bear season pass they are even more elusive........ I don't even target coyotes anymore if they happen to come in on a gray fox set that's awesome....A lot of guys start off predator hunting going for coyotes and soon grow sick of it and let their frustrations of not seeing any force them to give it up........I always tell people start on gray fox less stressful and the coyotes will come with time.........The very first predator stand I ever made, I ended up calling and missing a black coyote...........that was 100% luck but it began the book!
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;D ;D ;D ;DErnesto yo must be into the wino again..."Goose
Those 3 county's are east pa. :o :o :o Better check your map!! ::) ::) ::)
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gooses
and you thought I was only dyslexic
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Bee's
I hunted 5 states and pa is a hard one for coyotes.
I have found some pockets of coyotes in pa. I had my best luck North of Rt. 6 but I was targeting bobcat but ended up calling in a few coyotes and killing only 2 up there. 10 years ago there seamed to be more coyotes in the Renovo area then there is now. The south central pa area seams to have a growing population of coyotes. That is why I am checking to see what others are seeing.
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There are thee large groups of hound hunters in my area of Crawford county. The last few years each group has killed at least 60 coyotes and the numbers are going up each year.
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Nortpete
That would make sense. 10 to 15 years ago there were a lot of coyotes in Ohio. Pa guys were just starting to kill a few and Ohio guys already had a steady diet of coyotes. Just shows how once they get a foot hold they just keep spreading. I think if it was not for callers, trappers and hounds men the whole state would be over run real badly with these killer's.
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Buckwheat, also there are no foxes left here. When I go out on a set it's a coyote or nothing coming in. I see why like bees said first time predator hunters get discouraged real fast and give it up.
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Hunting 4 yotes
There should be some gray fox.
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I have never seen a grey fox in the woods around here. Reds were here before the coyotes appeared. If there around there's not many. I can't even recall anybody I know saying they even seen a grey.
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Hunting 4 yotes
That is possible, I have never seen a gray fox here either. Just red fox. I hope coyotes never get a strong hold here.
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Buckwheat, I also wonder about the fawn population. I was out before dark this evening watching a powerline and 4 different doe were feeding at different distances and i did not see any yearlings with them.
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Hunting 4 yotes
That is a hard one to figure out. I have doe at my feeder and only see the fawns every now and then. For a wile I did not think there were any fawns.
The PGC needs to do a real study and stop just using other states coyote information and get the facts on coyotes. and stop just using old information. They need to get out in the field and stop using second hand information from other states to make there reports. They need to have a real study on coyotes and real reports what they truly find if that is possible any more with these collage kids with no out door experience.
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Buckwheat, I agree with u 100% about the pgc.
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Buckwheat, I was lucky enough to kill one gray fox here in York County. I took him to a local fur buyer and he had a hard time believeing me that I killed it in York County.
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Misterjake
I seen a gray fox not far from you in wrightsville about 15 years ago. It was near hakes gun shop and the quarry.
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Unfortunately, coyotes will hurt your grey population too
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Trapping_john
In curtain parts of Texas there are tons of coyotes and gray fox living together. I wonder if they truly do afect the nunbers of gray fox in Pa. I think the Fisher is the big problem on gray fox.
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Hunting 4 yotes
That is a hard one to figure out. I have doe at my feeder and only see the fawns every now and then. For a wile I did not think there were any fawns.
The PGC needs to do a real study and stop just using other states coyote information and get the facts on coyotes. and stop just using old information. They need to get out in the field and stop using second hand information from other states to make there reports. They need to have a real study on coyotes and real reports what they truly find if that is possible any more with these collage kids with no out door experience.
Even if the PGC does a study and finds what many people already believe is a fact, that coyotes are a leading factor in the fawn mortality, whats the solution??
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You can no way compare a state like Texas with PA. Ive been to other states hunting and trapping and the terrain, population, food sources, etc. are all different. Heck, a fella from Texas told me a fox could live on nothing but snakes and bugs in texas all year long.
Everyone has their own opinion. Mine is based on 35 years of years of hunting an trapping.
Not only me, but many close friends and families that trapping and hunting is a way of life.
In the 80s and most of the 90s, we had a good population of both reds and greys. We experienced a great 20 year run with consistent catches and called fox. Around 1997, we started consistently catching a few coyotes. By 2000 - 2002 our fox catches were a 3rd of what they were during that 20 year run. Including the greys. There have been many changes over the years that have contributed to the fox decline, but the coyote is the most obvious change.
Since then I've seen it fluctuate. When we see a couple years of lower coyote numbers, the following couple years are better for fox.
As far as fisher go, what makes you think that? I saw the population shift long before the fisher took hold in my area. Matter of fact, we have less fisher here now than we did 5 years ago. Maybe the coyote are getting them too?
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Trapping_john
2G has the highest coyote population in the state. They also have the highest gray fox kill population in the state going by the kill record's. The gray fox population in a lot of places started to decrease before coyote numbers were even in some places.
As far as Fisher, we have no better killer in the state of pa on medium size game. On medium size animal's they are the best killers, even better then coyotes in my opion.
The reason I think the fisher is because of the Fisher number grow and gray fox start to disappear were I hunt.
I also have over 50 years of hunting and trapping experience and lived in the country all my life.
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Trapping_john
2G has the highest coyote population in the state. They also have the highest gray fox kill population in the state going by the kill record's.
So were you hunting 2G pre-coyote?
does today's population compare to years ago? When was the decline? What else changed at the same time?
Sounds like you are saying coyote populations don't influence grey fox population, only red fox. I say they have a direct effect on both
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I have hunted 2G before there were any coyotes killed there that I would have known of. I am sure there had to be at least a few killed but know way I would have known. We did not have the Internet back then.
I think the biggest thing is habitat change on gray fox numbers in most areas.
But I have hunted areas that only had gray fox and now there is fishers tracks there and gray fox are hard to find in those areas. Remember as a hunter I can only use what I see in my small areas I hunt. But this is just my opion. Just like yours is a opion. Like I said earlier the pgc needs to to a real study.
But I am not sure that is possible any more with the way things are run in the state.
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Agreed, we only know what we have experienced.
Too many times guys assume why things have changed. Had lots of greys, now lots of fisher.
This doesn't mean they were linked at all. I saw the changes gradually year to year.
In my area the coyotes increased and the fox decreased steadily over several years. Both red and grey
I'm not arguing the capability of the fishers, but I haven't seen an effect on my K9s because of them. If it is effecting them, it's at a much smaller scale
Now the turkey population, that's a different story
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Trapping_john
Look up fur harvest report pa
There some interesting numbers there that show coyote numbers and gray fox numbers.
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buckwheat........you're correct no better killer equipped with the tools to do so than a fisher.....
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Buckwheat and bees, I agree with u on the fisher. I have a pair of them on the property I hunt and can only imagine what damage there doing.
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Buck_Wheat
I have read the fur harvest report before.
I did look at the latest one again. Proves what I'm talking about. Go back and read my post.
Pretty sure that's exactly what I said
1997 thru 2000 was the biggest increase in coyote harvest
2000 thru 2003 was the biggest drop in grey fox harvest.
To answer your original question, according to the last survey, the following areas hold the most coyotes
2A, 3B, 2C, 1A then 2G
Couple more things I noticed about this survey
2000 vs 2012
License sold 17,414 to 36,192 +108%
Surveys sent in 1,557 to 4,080 +162%
Coyote kills 9,508 to 15,924 +67%
Greys killed 26,764 to 19,380 -28%
I know what happened in my area. The area I have always lived, not travel to to hunt or trap.
One thing we can agree on, the fisher, we don't need
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Trapping_john
LOL I do not have to reread you post.
Thanks for breaking that information down.
All good stuff. I was looking for information on coyote numbers across the state. But I also was looking for hunter input. Me and you got off track on the gray fox and coyote compatibility of them living together. PPHA is the best place becaused we can have seasoned predator hunters speak there opions and actually learn real stuff.
I looked at were you live in the state and you are in a very good spot in the state to definitely see the change in gray fox numbers.
Thanks for hanging in there with the facts. I can be hard to convince.
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Distemper killed off the Greys and Coon a few years ago in my area.
Coon have rebounded. Greys have slightly rebounded and are building up their numbers.
Mange hit hard on Reds and Coyote several years ago in my area.
Snow cover and bitter cold for most of last winter shorten many fur harvesters seasons.
Fur prices were down a few years ago.
What we can't read in the surveys and harvest reports are Weather Conditions, Fur Prices and Disease that affect the numbers.
Are more folks hunting and trapping Coyote in 2G to give that WMU top spot?
It's good to have those numbers to follow, but surveys don't state 'other factors'.
A Fisher is a dark Possum. Or I should state, Fisher are as easy to trap as a Possum.
Buckwheat, I don't know the best county for Coyote. But some areas will outshine even 2G. By that, where Coyotes have gain a foothold in traditional Fox territory and have a booming population right now until Coyote population levels to holding capacity.
I don't know these areas either. But local Fox guys will see as it happens.
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Hern
Good I asked is were coyotes population are the highest. Each person has there own idea of what is going on in there county.
But asking this question it also raised some questions on other critters. If we could get or own input on critter from members across the state we could end up with a little knolage.
This is a good challenge for its members. But only about a half dozen members talk on the board.
This could help us all kill more and meet members. Heck a few invitations from each other on hunts might help the club grow a little. We tried this before and only had I not a small turn out. Anyhow were are all the coyotes? :-)
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I think you'd be further ahead to concentrate on the closest local pocket of coyotes than to
travel to areas far away that you're not familiar with.
This would save on scouting time. IMO the more you know the land, the better off you are.
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Leglitter
I now that would be the best way. But we're is the adventure in that. LOL
I would like to hunt a place we're I can target more then one group. My place there is only one group close that I know of and they get pressure from others. If I want numbers of coyotes it is a drive for me. I really am not that interest in coyotes. But it would be nice if I ever decide to hunt coyotes a good population would make it better.
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I think you'd be further ahead to concentrate on the closest local pocket of coyotes than to
travel to areas far away that you're not familiar with.
This would save on scouting time. IMO the more you know the land, the better off you are.
I agree 100%.
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I think you'd be further ahead to concentrate on the closest local pocket of coyotes than to
travel to areas far away that you're not familiar with.
This would save on scouting time. IMO the more you know the land, the better off you are.
I agree 100%.
I agree 100% but not going to happen around here!
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I think you'd be further ahead to concentrate on the closest local pocket of coyotes than to
travel to areas far away that you're not familiar with.
This would save on scouting time. IMO the more you know the land, the better off you are.
I agree 100%.
I agree 100% but not going to happen around here!
Haha, guess its a blessing and a curse...I'll take a hand full of dumb dogs over a boat load of educated ones any day ;D
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QUATTRO, I rather take a boat load of young and dumb than one wised up Coyote.
I have taken a few educated Beaver and Coyote. It's hard work and time consuming. There isn't time during fur season to do this work. 10 young Fox/Coyote pay 10 times more than 1 educated Fox/Coyote.
Buckwheat, once again, I have no clue where the best Coyote hunting in our state. Let me know when you find out. LegLifter gave sound advise. And you probably wouldn't have to drive within an hour to hit different family groups.
Some times we can't see what's under our nose.
Buckwheat, why don't you kill a ton of Reds, take Barn shot pictures and become a living legend? ;D
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Hern
I know you think i should take advantage of the game in a person's home turf. But I do not own a barn, so much for that idea.
But you are right I should just enjoy coon and fox.
But one more bobcat would be a great adventure for me.
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Buckwheat, I know you like to travel.
Thishere predator hunting puts alot of miles on the Subaru.
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I have to go up and mow grass at camp soon.
I hope to get out a little for coyotes if just to listen.
The numbers of coyotes at camp is unknown to me this year. The last couple of years I have not hunted for coyotes there, it was hard to hear or see any so I just let that area go.
Maybe I should check it out again I am thinking.
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Yep there are coyotes around.
They are spotty and had to put a few miles on the road. But me and my brother called 5 in and shot one we missed two.
We were both complaining we did not take are Tri-X-Stand shooting rests.
(http://i843.photobucket.com/albums/zz356/trixstands/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-09/photo.jpg) (http://s843.photobucket.com/user/trixstands/media/Mobile%20Uploads/2014-09/photo.jpg.html)
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Nice yote bud! Local or upstate?
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Bowman66
I went up to camp at Renovo area.
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Congrats buckwheat...nice looking coyote!
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Good going Buckwheat.
There must be alot of Coyote in the Renovo area. ;D
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Nice mouth calls around your neck. Nice.
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Nice Job Ernie. I am going up this weekend. Leaving today after work actually. I hope to get a little hunting in myself after I move stands, hang stands and do some work on inside. Care to give me some hints? By the way what did you shoot it with (caliber)?
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Nice Ernie!!! Put them down! Was this daylight stands or night?
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Brushwolf
The one I shot was at daybreak, but we hunted from 3 am to about 9 am. But to much vegetation for shots at night. First light with sun rise at back was better for shooting in the thick fall woods. But I wish I did have my tripod. It is hard to hold still free hand. I had one coyote stand still broadside down a dirt road that I missed. I could have shot his eye out if I had my rest.
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Well that's still a hell of a morning! Shooting in the woods this time of the year is difficult no matter how good of a shot you are. Again WTG !
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Tim
If you want call me.
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I was up north this past weekend and the coyotes are fairly active. Although we did not get to squeeze the trigger, we had decent action. Had one coyote back door us in the thick stuff. As soon as I saw him he was gone (I was looking the wrong direction). located a small group of three or four but could not get them to commit. Also located what I think was a single coyote. Worked him for what seemed like hours with now success. Also located a pair which we could not hunt due to location.
We had a few incidental call ins as well. One bear to 10 yards (thank god I was looking in the right direction), which I thought I was going to have to shoot (finally took off), one bobcat to 13 yards and one bull elk to 30 yards. We also saw turkeys (not while hunting) and deer (while hunting and not). All in all a very tiring and busy weekend as I also hung stands, trimmed paths and lanes, removed all the taxidermy from the camp walls, cleaned and re-hung. My wife can't understand why I come home and have to rest. Lol.
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Lookn4fur
Sounds like a good weekend. I think I would have worried about the bull elk more then the bear if there were any cows
around.
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I agree but I didn't see any cows which I thought was strange. Being at night though they could have been anywhere and I just did not see them.
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Sounds like a successful weekend to me!!!